I don’t know a way to avoid propaganda among people who believe in what they perceive as “benevolent authority” and frame their presentation of their perceptions accordingly. As for myself, I still use the labels “American” and “Christian” and “Socialist” in spite of all of the hideous atrocities that have been committed under those banners. You are certainly right to condemn those atrocities and the complicity/hypocrisy (at best) of all those who identify with those banners (and many other similar banners besides).
I’ll have more to say about civility and its limits and potential in another post soon.
On a totally different topic, we have a friend who my other whole (instead of half) just saw who is hosts a radio show. She is a socialist and an Israeli who speaks up consistently for Palestinians. The two of them got talking about a recent Native guest and my spouse introduced her to plenary power and the Doctrine of Christian Discovery and Ginsberg’s thing from 2005; I was thinking you would make a perfect guest and you two would probably love to know each other. Would you like hubby or me to connect you? Or if you want, you can reach out directly and mention I sent you :) :) xo https://www.linkedin.com/in/esty-dinur-24517b2
Dear Alicia, I’m releasing my campaign manifesto tomorrow morning at 7:37 Chicago time for the Illinois 5th District Congressional seat. Please feel free to share it with your friends generally and this radio host in particular. Cheers, Steve
Hi Steven! to your point, I believe if someone truly believes in benevolent authority propaganda must be outlawed in the sense of legalized misinformation designed to promote a certain view that distorts ones perception whether by omission of key facts that would shape an honest (even if biased) presentation of the facts, along with using psyops of various sorts, ranging from neuroweapons to subliminal and emotional or libido manipulation. I noticed you mentioned Frued. I’m guessing you’re familiar with his relationship with the Bernays - Minna being a second wife to Freud as well as Anna Freud marrying into the Bernays family. Then we have Jung whose files are still very secret but who was applauded by Dulles. I’m reading his biography by Bair and it is FASCINATING. I highly recommend it. But to the point at hand, a really honest discussion of the transparency owed the people (I think it was Obama who legalized domestic propaganda) and what it means to come in genuineness. To truly believe in what one holds to be benevolent requires that ones believes in it sufficiently to not need to exaggerate the benefits, minimize the negatives, but to present a genuinely scientific picture from the heart.
I think honesty must always be in some tension with a belief in benevolent authority because honesty ultimately undermines all authority, especially pretentious and brutal authority but even “gentle” and “civil” authority. I think that for many in authority “civility”—with its express emphasis on the way concern for the common good serves self-interest—is attractive almost precisely because of rather than in spite of its hypocrisy. Indeed, fascism has been defined as doing at the metropole what had previously been allowed only on the periphery. Any government that presumes that it possesses the ability to distinguish between science and propaganda is likely heading towards fascism to the extent that it tries to enforce adherence to its views on the matter. I think it is essential, as Vaclav Havel put it, to “live in truth.” I just doubt the ability of any government to do so.
Yes, exactly. This is why I am so unsure why you are advocating for listening to the New Confus. ion ists. :) I completely agree! The passage my Honey read aloud ironically was one he described as “Laotse is a little frustrated.” Something like, “My teaching is the easiest to understand and no one can understand it. My teaching is even easier to implement and no one can implement it.” In the Tibetan tradition in the 8th century ish, which obviously historical has a lot of continuity with Mongolia and therefore China, the suggestion from the Spiritual leader was not to give to much power to the ministers and to rule with benevolent authority. There was a big showdown between those who were using blackmagick and Padmasambava and The King - and understandable reasons people didn’t like what Padma was doing as he violated their moral and social precepts. But it was prophesied that what is now the Nyingma school aka Secret Mantra would come to misuse and the result would be evil times. There was so much chaos he was advising a strong and benevolent hand. It is a useful paradigm for understanding compassionate how good people thought authority was necessary and at the time it may have been the best thing because actual Enlightened people were using it. But as you may know, ultimately there was a sellout in which what is now known as the third in the lineage we call the Dalai Lama but actually was the first (and two previous were retro labeled) made a weighed decision, perhaps not unsimilar to those you face when you align yourself with movements you know are problematic but you see the potential for good to come out of a compromise. The future leader of Mongolia, Altan, couldn’t get into power without being in the line of Kublai Khan, so the deal was arranged that Sonam Gyatso declare him the recincarnation of Kublai’s lineage in exchange for getting to Buddhify Mongolia and they enterered into the opposite of separation of Church and State. Since then then office of the DL had been controlled alternately by M and C, with there being some mysterious murders of DLs and changes in how the DL is chosen when C is in charge of it. It is likely what unseemly deaths may have been precipitated by those who didn’t think he was the authentic one when C chose as well as when C didn’t like it when the authentic one was chosen. Additionally, as predicted, the sexual abuse in Buddhism, including Tibetan Buddhism is as pervasive as in the Christian and Catholic Church, and perhaps more insidious because those who come forward are told they are breaking the their Samaya vows and gaslighted from that direction. Anyway how, I think leaders like Hathor and Isis (as in The Sophia Code,) led with both benevolent authority and non denomination but it was an expression of their Enlightened consciousness. Likewise, as you know, I have deep criticisms of the movements that birthed all the Isms as they are all linked to anti-G-d movements with sinister underlays beyond atheism or a rejection of dom in the name of G-d. The Indigenous Pathways are the closest we have to leadership models that are hyper local yet also form cooperatives, and they are the closest to what is suggested by the frustrated Sage who got off the Stage, who suggested small countries, few people non-domination, modeling brilliant virtue, but not forcing it <3 Congrats on your upcoming run - that is a brave YEAH to stepping into a space that needs people with hearts like yours. May citizen counsels that truly represent the people replace the DOGE and may compassionate, wise leadership that honors kindness and freedom, empowering people to self-leadership in communion with life and respect for the authentic consent that is vital to all relationships. <3
"...the illumination of “brilliant virtue” in the world is a task that Chinese and American politicians could undertake together as partners rather than as rivals."
What evidence is here that Americans have any interest in "brilliant virtue" that might sustain a partnership?
I could go farther and indicate that “virtue”—as conceived by those who believe in “benevolent authority”—is an inadequate foundation for the maintenance of right relations. Neither the emphasis on “virtue” of late eighteenth century Americans, nor their democratic institutions, prevented the Trail of Tears…
I agree. Where if at all do you see it from the Sino side? I see a lot of attempts to appear virtuous but it appears more likely tactic to gain the upper hand per your argument that those who appear more virtuous will win, given the behavior evident when it comes to how dissidents are treated.
I love this passage:
"If the western advocates of “democracy and human rights” were honest on the issue of a peaceful democratic transition for China, they would have to admit that they have no practical advice to offer. This is one reason why a measure of humility is called for in advocating such change for China. Those who care about the cause of genuine democracy in China (or, for that matter, in the United States) should look first to supporting the recovery by the peoples of the Native Nations of their original free and independent existence. It is from these nations that the world has learned much of what little it knows of genuine democracy and of the rule, or, better said, the authentic self-government, of peoples rather than states. The framework of civility and civilization—a framework that China and the West share despite all their apparent differences—is ultimately inadequate for the conduct of genuine self-government by peoples; the conduct of self-government by human collectivities who recognize all living beings as our kith and kin”
I disagree about embracing neo confucianism if its a guise for obedience to state authority, which really in Chinas case I see as globalism rather than about authentic Chinese autonomy. If I dig where my curiosity goes, I get too many bots that I can’t block.
But suffice to say, why not encourage authentic Chinese opening to Laotse instead of Confucianism since it is a much easier bridge to living in harmony with life and one another from the wellspring we all share rather than based on a forced code that can be tyrannical in the name of benevolence, as was the case with the covid measures, particularly in China, not to mention all the ways China and the US collaborated to engage in gross negligence in its worst forms at very best, leading to said pandemic?
I have been deeply impressed and moved by Tu Weiming’s book, “The Global Significance of Concrete Humanity,” and was greatly encouraged by his return to China in 2010 to serve as the founding dean for the institute for advanced humanistic studies at Beijing University.
That’s wonderful! And I see in the quote by him a sense of measured protocol to move people toward more balance rather than dominance. I may have missed it but I felt the energy of it was more political (in a good way to me) than the spiritual underlay that I feel when I read Lao Tse’s words, especially regarding gentlenenss, non-violence and freedom. In a sense it is none of my business as a non-interventionist how China governs itself if it isn’t seeking to impose that on others (unless, as I have seen, it stalks/surveils and attempt to control and harasses those who have chosen to leave and want to live outside its borders or sets up secret labs (at least one in California,) and owns vast lands and the empty property of a mall with creepy tunnels in WI, and attempts to impose its laws/will on those people who wish to no longer be a part of the oppression…
I am glad that at least Tu Weiming is allowed to teach…that is a fine start.
Why did you advocate for Confus.ion ism at the end when I can see your heart isnt in it?
Zhang Zai speaks to me from a tradition that I think you too readily disparage: “Heaven is my father and Earth is my mother, and even such a small creature as I finds an intimate place in their midst. Therefore that which fills the universe I regard as my body and that which directs the universe I consider as my nature. All people are my brothers and sisters, and all things are my companions.”
I don’t remember if you recall the piece I did on genocide and its opposite a while ago but Saudi A is another one that is moving toward globalism in an open way quite fast, so it gives the appearance of becoming more open to women in leadership, as shown by a film recently in which S collaborated with Germany to produce a film depicting an extremely attractive female leader, and other comments emerging from there indicating a move to modernization but if you look at the connections between the leaders and ruling families, it’s all globalism as far as I can see it - the costumes and means of regulating the people to conform to what is desired at the moment simply change.
Ah! So much here. When I saw it in my inbox my gut was like, “I can’t read it now. I know Steven is going to trigger me.” I waited. My husband happened to pick up up a copy of Lao Tse’s famous book and was reading aloud from it on the deck. No idea you posted this, of course. Have you considered tracing China back to the Yuan Dynasty and discussing the roll of Rockefeller and the cavorting of intelligence with the Green Gang and its origins? I love how bridge build when you bring in the 4th way - the way of benevolent non denomination. I feel that two threads more significant than the ones propagated by statesman all sides is the thread of opium, LSD and intelligence. The other is the thread of propaganda, which I see in every comment from various statestmen. I could care less for the words. Tell me what the woman who has had her organs stolen says.
Thanks Alicia,
I don’t know a way to avoid propaganda among people who believe in what they perceive as “benevolent authority” and frame their presentation of their perceptions accordingly. As for myself, I still use the labels “American” and “Christian” and “Socialist” in spite of all of the hideous atrocities that have been committed under those banners. You are certainly right to condemn those atrocities and the complicity/hypocrisy (at best) of all those who identify with those banners (and many other similar banners besides).
I’ll have more to say about civility and its limits and potential in another post soon.
On a totally different topic, we have a friend who my other whole (instead of half) just saw who is hosts a radio show. She is a socialist and an Israeli who speaks up consistently for Palestinians. The two of them got talking about a recent Native guest and my spouse introduced her to plenary power and the Doctrine of Christian Discovery and Ginsberg’s thing from 2005; I was thinking you would make a perfect guest and you two would probably love to know each other. Would you like hubby or me to connect you? Or if you want, you can reach out directly and mention I sent you :) :) xo https://www.linkedin.com/in/esty-dinur-24517b2
Dear Alicia, I’m releasing my campaign manifesto tomorrow morning at 7:37 Chicago time for the Illinois 5th District Congressional seat. Please feel free to share it with your friends generally and this radio host in particular. Cheers, Steve
Hi Steven! to your point, I believe if someone truly believes in benevolent authority propaganda must be outlawed in the sense of legalized misinformation designed to promote a certain view that distorts ones perception whether by omission of key facts that would shape an honest (even if biased) presentation of the facts, along with using psyops of various sorts, ranging from neuroweapons to subliminal and emotional or libido manipulation. I noticed you mentioned Frued. I’m guessing you’re familiar with his relationship with the Bernays - Minna being a second wife to Freud as well as Anna Freud marrying into the Bernays family. Then we have Jung whose files are still very secret but who was applauded by Dulles. I’m reading his biography by Bair and it is FASCINATING. I highly recommend it. But to the point at hand, a really honest discussion of the transparency owed the people (I think it was Obama who legalized domestic propaganda) and what it means to come in genuineness. To truly believe in what one holds to be benevolent requires that ones believes in it sufficiently to not need to exaggerate the benefits, minimize the negatives, but to present a genuinely scientific picture from the heart.
I think honesty must always be in some tension with a belief in benevolent authority because honesty ultimately undermines all authority, especially pretentious and brutal authority but even “gentle” and “civil” authority. I think that for many in authority “civility”—with its express emphasis on the way concern for the common good serves self-interest—is attractive almost precisely because of rather than in spite of its hypocrisy. Indeed, fascism has been defined as doing at the metropole what had previously been allowed only on the periphery. Any government that presumes that it possesses the ability to distinguish between science and propaganda is likely heading towards fascism to the extent that it tries to enforce adherence to its views on the matter. I think it is essential, as Vaclav Havel put it, to “live in truth.” I just doubt the ability of any government to do so.
Yes, exactly. This is why I am so unsure why you are advocating for listening to the New Confus. ion ists. :) I completely agree! The passage my Honey read aloud ironically was one he described as “Laotse is a little frustrated.” Something like, “My teaching is the easiest to understand and no one can understand it. My teaching is even easier to implement and no one can implement it.” In the Tibetan tradition in the 8th century ish, which obviously historical has a lot of continuity with Mongolia and therefore China, the suggestion from the Spiritual leader was not to give to much power to the ministers and to rule with benevolent authority. There was a big showdown between those who were using blackmagick and Padmasambava and The King - and understandable reasons people didn’t like what Padma was doing as he violated their moral and social precepts. But it was prophesied that what is now the Nyingma school aka Secret Mantra would come to misuse and the result would be evil times. There was so much chaos he was advising a strong and benevolent hand. It is a useful paradigm for understanding compassionate how good people thought authority was necessary and at the time it may have been the best thing because actual Enlightened people were using it. But as you may know, ultimately there was a sellout in which what is now known as the third in the lineage we call the Dalai Lama but actually was the first (and two previous were retro labeled) made a weighed decision, perhaps not unsimilar to those you face when you align yourself with movements you know are problematic but you see the potential for good to come out of a compromise. The future leader of Mongolia, Altan, couldn’t get into power without being in the line of Kublai Khan, so the deal was arranged that Sonam Gyatso declare him the recincarnation of Kublai’s lineage in exchange for getting to Buddhify Mongolia and they enterered into the opposite of separation of Church and State. Since then then office of the DL had been controlled alternately by M and C, with there being some mysterious murders of DLs and changes in how the DL is chosen when C is in charge of it. It is likely what unseemly deaths may have been precipitated by those who didn’t think he was the authentic one when C chose as well as when C didn’t like it when the authentic one was chosen. Additionally, as predicted, the sexual abuse in Buddhism, including Tibetan Buddhism is as pervasive as in the Christian and Catholic Church, and perhaps more insidious because those who come forward are told they are breaking the their Samaya vows and gaslighted from that direction. Anyway how, I think leaders like Hathor and Isis (as in The Sophia Code,) led with both benevolent authority and non denomination but it was an expression of their Enlightened consciousness. Likewise, as you know, I have deep criticisms of the movements that birthed all the Isms as they are all linked to anti-G-d movements with sinister underlays beyond atheism or a rejection of dom in the name of G-d. The Indigenous Pathways are the closest we have to leadership models that are hyper local yet also form cooperatives, and they are the closest to what is suggested by the frustrated Sage who got off the Stage, who suggested small countries, few people non-domination, modeling brilliant virtue, but not forcing it <3 Congrats on your upcoming run - that is a brave YEAH to stepping into a space that needs people with hearts like yours. May citizen counsels that truly represent the people replace the DOGE and may compassionate, wise leadership that honors kindness and freedom, empowering people to self-leadership in communion with life and respect for the authentic consent that is vital to all relationships. <3
"...the illumination of “brilliant virtue” in the world is a task that Chinese and American politicians could undertake together as partners rather than as rivals."
What evidence is here that Americans have any interest in "brilliant virtue" that might sustain a partnership?
I see no evidence of any such interest in the present American leadership or, for that matter, in the Biden administration either.
I could go farther and indicate that “virtue”—as conceived by those who believe in “benevolent authority”—is an inadequate foundation for the maintenance of right relations. Neither the emphasis on “virtue” of late eighteenth century Americans, nor their democratic institutions, prevented the Trail of Tears…
I agree. Where if at all do you see it from the Sino side? I see a lot of attempts to appear virtuous but it appears more likely tactic to gain the upper hand per your argument that those who appear more virtuous will win, given the behavior evident when it comes to how dissidents are treated.
I love this passage:
"If the western advocates of “democracy and human rights” were honest on the issue of a peaceful democratic transition for China, they would have to admit that they have no practical advice to offer. This is one reason why a measure of humility is called for in advocating such change for China. Those who care about the cause of genuine democracy in China (or, for that matter, in the United States) should look first to supporting the recovery by the peoples of the Native Nations of their original free and independent existence. It is from these nations that the world has learned much of what little it knows of genuine democracy and of the rule, or, better said, the authentic self-government, of peoples rather than states. The framework of civility and civilization—a framework that China and the West share despite all their apparent differences—is ultimately inadequate for the conduct of genuine self-government by peoples; the conduct of self-government by human collectivities who recognize all living beings as our kith and kin”
I disagree about embracing neo confucianism if its a guise for obedience to state authority, which really in Chinas case I see as globalism rather than about authentic Chinese autonomy. If I dig where my curiosity goes, I get too many bots that I can’t block.
But suffice to say, why not encourage authentic Chinese opening to Laotse instead of Confucianism since it is a much easier bridge to living in harmony with life and one another from the wellspring we all share rather than based on a forced code that can be tyrannical in the name of benevolence, as was the case with the covid measures, particularly in China, not to mention all the ways China and the US collaborated to engage in gross negligence in its worst forms at very best, leading to said pandemic?
I have been deeply impressed and moved by Tu Weiming’s book, “The Global Significance of Concrete Humanity,” and was greatly encouraged by his return to China in 2010 to serve as the founding dean for the institute for advanced humanistic studies at Beijing University.
That’s wonderful! And I see in the quote by him a sense of measured protocol to move people toward more balance rather than dominance. I may have missed it but I felt the energy of it was more political (in a good way to me) than the spiritual underlay that I feel when I read Lao Tse’s words, especially regarding gentlenenss, non-violence and freedom. In a sense it is none of my business as a non-interventionist how China governs itself if it isn’t seeking to impose that on others (unless, as I have seen, it stalks/surveils and attempt to control and harasses those who have chosen to leave and want to live outside its borders or sets up secret labs (at least one in California,) and owns vast lands and the empty property of a mall with creepy tunnels in WI, and attempts to impose its laws/will on those people who wish to no longer be a part of the oppression…
I am glad that at least Tu Weiming is allowed to teach…that is a fine start.
Why did you advocate for Confus.ion ism at the end when I can see your heart isnt in it?
Zhang Zai speaks to me from a tradition that I think you too readily disparage: “Heaven is my father and Earth is my mother, and even such a small creature as I finds an intimate place in their midst. Therefore that which fills the universe I regard as my body and that which directs the universe I consider as my nature. All people are my brothers and sisters, and all things are my companions.”
I don’t remember if you recall the piece I did on genocide and its opposite a while ago but Saudi A is another one that is moving toward globalism in an open way quite fast, so it gives the appearance of becoming more open to women in leadership, as shown by a film recently in which S collaborated with Germany to produce a film depicting an extremely attractive female leader, and other comments emerging from there indicating a move to modernization but if you look at the connections between the leaders and ruling families, it’s all globalism as far as I can see it - the costumes and means of regulating the people to conform to what is desired at the moment simply change.
Ah! So much here. When I saw it in my inbox my gut was like, “I can’t read it now. I know Steven is going to trigger me.” I waited. My husband happened to pick up up a copy of Lao Tse’s famous book and was reading aloud from it on the deck. No idea you posted this, of course. Have you considered tracing China back to the Yuan Dynasty and discussing the roll of Rockefeller and the cavorting of intelligence with the Green Gang and its origins? I love how bridge build when you bring in the 4th way - the way of benevolent non denomination. I feel that two threads more significant than the ones propagated by statesman all sides is the thread of opium, LSD and intelligence. The other is the thread of propaganda, which I see in every comment from various statestmen. I could care less for the words. Tell me what the woman who has had her organs stolen says.